[mannydingo]

Hi, and a big hello to everyone(my first post). I hope to be able to help others here in the future too. I recently bought a 1998 Ford Escort SE Wagon. It has a 2.0 SOHC engine. The car turns the engine but would not start. A mechanic two doors down, who has helped me greatly in the past, tested the electricity from the plugs going into the fuel injectors and there was no electricity going into the injectors. There is also no power at the fuel pump and no power coming from the spark plug cables. The battery is brand new and the lights inside the car turn on and you hear the car interior sounds. None of the fuses inside the car or in the engine compartment are blown. No wires seem to be damaged but I can't be sure of all of them. What could keep those three areas from gettting power all at the same time? If it was only one I could think of what to repair or replace but all these three? There may be more areas not getting power but I haven't tested more yet and don't yet think I need more proof it's a compoment that handles many areas of power at a time. You know, like the computer. I don't want to start replacing parts and spending money to find that it isn't the problem. Any help would be greatly appreciated. ........... Jorge

 

[rellimpk]

My first impression would be the ingition module/coils/whatever, but with the pump not getting power? That's odd. I would still check the entire ignition system to be safe. If you're not sure how, go buy a Haynes (or Chiltons) manual, they can be a great help.

And I would like to officially welcome you to FEOA, if you have any questions, comments, or problems, please feel free to send a PM to either me or any of the other moderators or admins.

 

[mannydingo]

Thanks for the welcome and for a good try but this has got to be bigger than the ignition system alone. I think it can be resolved with just a single unit's replacement. I'm suspecting the CCRM (Constant Control Relay Module) that sits under the air cleaner in the engine compartment. It controls the fan, a/c, fuel pump and more. Since it affects the PCM(Powertain Control Module), it makes me want to check it out. My problem is trial & error and what it costs. The computer is another possibility. I have used both Haynes and Chilton manuals for years and can't say of how much value they have been for me. As a matter of fact, whenever I buy a used car, I buy both manuals for the car. Sometimes only one is available. With this Ford, I have also bought the Service Manual CD off one of those many people that sell them on ebay. I just got it yesterday. I skimmed through it and it looks intersting.

 

[rellimpk]

Cool, looks like you pretty much know what you're doing. And I didn't mean to insult you or anything with the simplicity and obviousness of my message. You'd be surprised how many people don't know that there are manuals out there for our cars.

 

[fixitmattman]

Try checking the eec power relay. I doubth they moved it between 2nd and 3rd gens, so it should be located behind the center console, near the passengers foot area. It will be a brown relay. Also, try checking the emergency fuel cutout. It's located at the rear of the car (trunk) on the passenger side. You'll see a pull out access panel. I know for sure it will cut out the fuel pump, but not sure about the ignition. It's worth a shot to look at though.

Hope that helps :wink:

Matt 8)

 

[mannydingo]

Paul, I didn't find an insult. I know a lot of people don't know the value of the manuals and that you thought I may be the same. It's good that you make the suggestion. Fixitmattman, I already checked the cutout switch which is located to the left of the fuse compartment in my 98 SE Wagon but the EEC relay I have not looked into nor have even read about. I will see what circuits it affects and see if there's a possibility of a problem there too. Today (Tuesday) and tomorrow will be my days off and let's see what happens. Since the used car place will allow me to return the CCRM if it doesn't help me, I'm going to try that first and then a couple of other areas. If it's a no-go, then it's to the Ford dealership. Send me the charity checks folks if that's the way it ends. ............. Jorge

 

[fixitmattman]

I already checked the cutout switch which is located to the left of the fuse compartment in my 98 SE Wagon but the EEC relay I have not looked into nor have even read about. I will see what circuits it affects and see if there's a possibility of a problem there too.

Ok, so they moved the fuel cutout from 2nd to 3rd gen. No prob, at least you checked it. The eec power relay pretty well controls power to everything, as it provides power to the eec which controls everything. It controls spark via the edis module, the fuel pump, and especially injector outputl.

Hope that helps :wink:

Matt 8)

 

[Sajeevan]

Do your dash lights come on when you fire the ignition? If not it could be the ignition switch which is located in the the ignition column. It should be after the houseing where the key is put in.

You can start your car by jumping the connection between two of the wires. You have to figure out which one using a tester and an electical diagram. (Maybe the big blue one and the black one (for a 2nd gen))

In an ignition switch failure, the dash lights stay off when the car is in the on position.

O.k. hope this helps. Let me know.

Saj I didn't read the whole post but I wanted to suggest another idea.

 

[mannydingo]

Well guys, it wasn't the CCRM and it has been returned. I now have looked at the Ford CD and the CCRM and PCM are definitely not the same thing. PCM is the name for the computer. You know like ECM and ECU.
Hi Sajeevan. Would this ignition problem you're talking about cause no spark at the cables, no power at the fuel injectors and also no power at the fuel pump? If it would not cause the other problems then I don't think it has to do with the ignition switch. It's too late right now for me to check the car which is at my dad's home to check the instrument panel lights.

 

[mannydingo]

Matt, where is that EEC power relay you are talking about. The CD service manual shows no unit with that acronym. It talks about an Electronic EC System That could be ECC but it talks of the Electronic ECC system as a combination of components with different names but no specific relay like that. Where is it located on your Escort? Thanks.

 

[SyStEmDw]

Ford mistery! :lol: :wink:

 

[fixitmattman]

If you know where the EEC module is, they're right there. The EEC and FuelPump relays are located by the passenger side foot well. You'll have to remove a section of trim right be the foot well, closest to the center console to get at it. The EEC relay is brown, and the fuel pump relay is green.

Matt 8)

 

[Sajeevan]

Well guys, it wasn't the CCRM and it has been returned. I now have looked at the Ford CD and the CCRM and PCM are definitely not the same thing. PCM is the name for the computer. You know like ECM and ECU.
Hi Sajeevan. Would this ignition problem you're talking about cause no spark at the cables, no power at the fuel injectors and also no power at the fuel pump? If it would not cause the other problems then I don't think it has to do with the ignition switch. It's too late right now for me to check the car which is at my dad's home to check the instrument panel lights.

The ignition switch problem can definately cause NO SPARK at the cables, many of the circuits remain off. Its as if the starter motor turns but the "car is off". Literally!!

So this is a very serious problem with a simple fix!!

Take me seriously and check it out!!

Don't delay no more. Of course consider the other things you're considering as well.

I told you how to diagnose this problem without buying a new ignition switch. You need to hotwire your car to start. If you don't know how to do it, take it to a mechanic.

Saj

 

[Sajeevan]

Mannydingo,

Did you diagnose the problem? Have you worked on the problem? Or did you fix the problem. Please keep us posted.

Saj

 

[mannydingo]

Saj, before I had a chance to mention, or even remember, about the EEC, the mechanic told me he had tried a million things and recommended I buy the computer (the PCM). I had totally forgotten your reply post. I went to the junkyard and bought a PCM. He put it in and for the first time since it stopped working, he made the car start. It now would start but only by spraying starter fluid in the engine. That's because he found that the fuel pump doesn't work. At least it now has spark at the plug wires and going to the fuel pump and I imagine to the injectors. He removed the fuel pump from the car and tested it outside and it did not work there either. I will now have to buy it and possibly one more component of the fuel system. He told me to buy the fuel pump alone and then, if needed, buy the other part.

 

[Sajeevan]

I'm glad you identified the problem manny. I guess the PCM (computer) not working would cut out the power to everything too.

Wow the number of things that go wrong with a car never ceases to amaze me.

But it looks like you're in good hands. Take care,
Saj