Drivetrain - Is it the tranny pump? | Ford Escort Owners Association (FEOA)
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Drivetrain Is it the tranny pump?

Discussion in 'Drivetrains' started by Mike F, May 29, 2016.

  1. Mike F

    Mike F New Member

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    I have a 1995 Escort Wagon, 1.9l engine with 4 speed automatic transmission. It has about 190,000 miles on it. It has the F-4EAT transmission.

    The tranny stopped working in all gears. When it stopped working I pulled away from a stop and the engine rev'd up to the point where it should have upshifted to 2nd gear. It didn't. It won't move in any gear.....forward or reverse. Linkage is good, I changed the fluid and filter, pulled the regulator valve from the pump body to be sure it wasn't stuck,.....blah, blah, blah. I have gone through all available forums and internet stuff to diagnose the problem.

    No failure codes are present when I run a diagnostic.

    I hooked up a pressure gauge to the Line Pressure port on top of the tranny. I get NO pressure. I have the specs for this port as I shift through all gears. I got the info on pressure specs from ATSG publications. I shift the tranny through all gears and still get no pressure. My logic tells me my pump is bad but I'm just trying to validate this by throwing out the issue to this forum. I don't want to buy a rebuilt pump and not solve the problem. I know this tranny is high;t electronic and don't know if solenoids could be preventing pressure at the ports or causing the "no drive" situation.

    Thanks for any input.

    Mike
  2. zzyzzx

    zzyzzx FEOA Member

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    I tend to agree with your assessment that the transmission pump might be bad. As long as you are absolutely sure that you were checking at the right port (and I think there are instructions here somewhere). If I recall correctly, someone here had a similar issue, but it was not the transmission pump itself, but something that connects the transmission pump to the rest of the transmission (so the pump itself was not spinning).
  3. denisond3

    denisond3 Moderator Staff Member

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    Welcome to the forums!
    Any time the engine is idling, you should have fluid pressure at the 'line pressure port" even if the solenoids were not-working. The port is the one on the lower front of the transmission, with an "L" cast into the case next to it.
    Were there shiny metal shaving in the oil pan when the fluid was changed?
    There is a steel shaft about 5/16 ths or 3/8" diameter, shaft running from the inside of the torque converter, over to the oil pump at the far end of the transmission. Its job is to spin the oil pump. It is splined at both ends. If that had snapped the oil pump would not be turning, though I dont know any good way to tell.
    On the top corner of the transmission on the driver's side, below the front edge of the battery tray, is a small sensor held down with a bolted clamp. This is the "turbine sensor". It gets its signal from the serrated circular surface of the drum that is being spun by the turbine shaft. If there was fluid in the transmission and the transmission was in neutral - this drum would be turning & the serrations would be seen to be spinning past ,though not as fast as the engine is turning.

    Im no pro mechanic, just a hobbyist. I dont think there is much you can do to any automatic transmission until you open it up on a workbench for an autopsy. But the F4EAT transmissioins arent very difficult to give a quick 'rebuild', with new frictionals and steel rings in the clutch packs.
    Your description of the symptoms of it not moving the car and the engine being able to rev up is consistent with one or more of the clutch packs inside being worn out. It could also be something jammed inside the valve body.

    Being a 2nd gen Escort, I dont think there are much in the way of trouble codes due to transmission problems.
  4. zzyzzx

    zzyzzx FEOA Member

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    Read this:
    https://www.feoa.net/threads/atratb039-02-01-1991-a-t-g4a-el-4eat-low-pump-pressure.61690/

    Since it's really easy to check that "valve" and spring, go ahead and look at it, just to make sure it isn't something easy to fix like a broken spring. It is transmission oil pump related.

    And I am once of a few regulars here with well over 200K on my original 1995LX's automatic transmission (yes, I bought the car new). I'm closing on in 236K miles.
  5. zzyzzx

    zzyzzx FEOA Member

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    I wish I could find the thread where this was the problem, but I would hope that one could fix something like this just by removing the pump.
  6. Mike F

    Mike F New Member

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    The 2 magnets in the transmission pan had small, fine shavings but nothing big or "new" looking. Nothing I wouldn't expect from a tranny with almost 200k on it. The transmission made no noise or clunking when it stopped working. I had no slippage at all before it stopped working. I will recheck Line Pressure at some of the other Line Pressure ports to verify the "no pressure" condition.

    I located a rebuilt pump for $160.....
  7. zzyzzx

    zzyzzx FEOA Member

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    Do they not have U-pull-it junkyards near you? I'd just grab one and take it to the counter and when they ask what it is, say it's a pump.
  8. denisond3

    denisond3 Moderator Staff Member

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    For me, getting to that pump to remove it from a JY transmission is more than I care to undertake. Maybe its my old back; since I would have to work from inside the fender to get the bottom bolts out.
    I would also want to know beforehand if the yard was willing to sell just enough of a transmission to make the remainder unsellable. Some may allow it, but I know some will not.
  9. denisond3

    denisond3 Moderator Staff Member

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    The other factor I would consider: With 190k miles on it, how much more life will that transmission have? The amount of life remaining could depend on whether the miles on the car were from long commutes on a highway, or lots of local trips in town or even the suburbs.
  10. Mike F

    Mike F New Member

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    I checked the Line Pressure at another port on the transmission....no pressure through all gears.

    I also pulled the turbine sensor to see if the turbine shaft is spinning...it is. I'm going to take the pump off and check for the shaft that turns the pump to see if it is the reason I have no pump pressure. Aside from that I can't pull just the pump off a transmission at the pick-n-pull yards here as it makes the transmission unsellable. I will buy a rebuilt pump and go from there.

    I appreciate the input from all.....thx.
  11. zzyzzx

    zzyzzx FEOA Member

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    Didn't stop me from grabbing a solenoid a couple of years ago... When I got to the counter they guy asked what it was and I said "solenoid", so he charged me for a starter solenoid. $6.50 is way cheaper than what a new transmission solenoid costs. Besides that, for $160, you should be able to get the whole transmission at the junkyard.
    bent_rod likes this.
  12. Gamer92

    Gamer92 FEOA Donator

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    Where can you buy pumps?
  13. zzyzzx

    zzyzzx FEOA Member

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    eBay. Junkyards. Partouts.
    In so far as eBay, you probably won't see one listed, but I would just send a message to other people who seem to be selling used transmission parts and see if they have one.
  14. denisond3

    denisond3 Moderator Staff Member

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    I have seen a rebuilt F4EAT oil pump for sale on ebay. Starting price was $175. For that much money, I think I would look for a complete F4EAT, so as to have all the extra parts and a spare valve body.
    zzyzzx likes this.
  15. Mike F

    Mike F New Member

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    I pulled the pump today. Had to take off the engine mounts on the drivers side as well as the support under the engine transmission. Pump pulled out. Shaft is good and it turns. I bumped the engine with no spark and had someone watch it and it turned as the engine bumped over.

    Also, I did find a rebuilt pump at Makco Transmission Parts. They are out of Florida. Cost $160.
  16. zzyzzx

    zzyzzx FEOA Member

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    Post some pics of the pump all by itself please!
  17. zzyzzx

    zzyzzx FEOA Member

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    With the pump out of the transmission, can you rotate the pump and does it seem to produce any pressure (if you can tell).
  18. zzyzzx

    zzyzzx FEOA Member

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    I'm wondering if we are going to hear back from Mike F??
  19. Gage

    Gage New Member

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    Has there been any luck in determining what was wrong with the transmission? I'm attempting to repair a '95 with the same issue, except the car only has 135,000 miles on it.

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