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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Well where do I start?

I was driving home from dropping the g/f off at her home. For the past few days I've been testing how my gt handles corners at different speeds. As I was driving home I decided to test some more. Now it's been raining all day, so you think that would have set off a few mental alarms. Not in this hunk of gray matter it didn't :/

I hit a couple corners just right as I was driving home, enough to where I could keep the car under control and slide right through the corner (however ungraceful it may look in a FWD car) As I came around the 2nd to last corner of the evenings course, I decide to punch it to get up a little speed. About half way through the straight I let off the gas and downshift to slow down for the corner, and turned the wheel to slide a bit into the left turn. This is where I lost it. The car turned maybe 20 degrees and just slid straight through into a ditch at the intersection. Luckily enough for me, my cat-like reflexes were fast enough to catch the brakes and the pull the ebrake immediately. Of course I still slid, but it greatly dampened my speed as I slide right into the ditch as perfectly as one could do. No body damage, just left the front right tire off the ground and the left one not moving at all.

I curse myself for being so stupid a few times, then get out to inspect the damage, as I said, there was none (thank god :)) So I walk back and forth looking for some cars. It's around 9:30pm at this time so most people were at home. A guy with driving a truck came by and said he didn't have anything to pull me out with, but he had a phone I could use. I called my dad to come pull me out and the guy took off.

Now this road isn't a shortcut to anything, and I've never seen a cop driving down that road. But low and behold, with my great karma, I see a state trooper pull up on the opposite side of the road and flip her lights, they were on their way to a forest fire in the next town over apparently, though it's been raining all FREAKIN day! So now I'm freaking out. This is the first 'accident' I've ever been in and didn't really know what to expect.

As I stood up to greet the officer I had my hands kinda behind my back with my fingers hooked into my belt loops (mistake #1). She immediately takes the offensive and starts yelling at me to show her my hands, I apologize profusely and hold them out. She walks over to me and starts looking at the car and asks what happened. I say "I don't know, I was just driving home and when I turned to go around this corner I lost traction and ended up in the ditch" she kinda looks at me and goes around to the other side of the car to see what's up over there. Then this plain clothed trooper gets out of the car and asks her a couple questions. She comes back to me and asks for my license (no registration or insurance though, which raised a few questions in my head, but I wasn't going to bring it up) I hand it to her and she goes back to the patrol car to do her thing. The guy, after seemingly throroughly inspecting my car, walks over to me and asks if I had tried to get it out. I told him yeh, I had tried but there's nothing for traction on the front tires. The trooper asks if he could try to get it out to which I reply, "Yeh, go ahead, do you know how to drive a stick?" (mistake #2) He looks at me with a 'you stupid punk' look and says "I haven't been driving for 15 years to not know how to drive a manual." I left it at that as I'm not about to spout off to a trooper who could potentially arrest me for some reason unbeknownst to me at the time. Anywho... after he fiddles with the gears some, the trooper tries to get it to move with no avail. He turns off the car, get's out, and hands me the keys saying, "Yep, It's stuck." Again I hold back any condesending "really, dipshit?" looks and mutter a "Yeh."

He goes over to the patrol car and asks the female trooper a couple questions, I hear some babbling over the radio that sounds like my full name and address (muy impressivo!). He comes back over to me and starts asking me some more questions. "How much have you had to drink tonight." I shot him probably one of the worst looks I could come up with but quickly covered with a chuckle and a "No, sir, I don't drink and drive." I don't know, but to me that was rude to basically assume that I had been drinking (maybe it's some uber secret cop tactic to fool drunks into telling you or something, I don't know). He also asks if I "had been smoking any pot or dope this evening either." I told him no, it was just an accident. And then he asks a question to which I completely regret replying to. "How fast were you going around this corner here?" to which I say "Oh I don't know, maybe 35 or 45." Truthfully I had no idea how fast I was going, but the corner, in wet coniditions should have been taken at around 15 or 20. The trooper kinda nods to me and heads back over to the squad car and talks to the female trooper some more.

She gets out of the car and comes over to me with her clipboard/ticket form holder while scribbling some stuff on it. I cursed myself some more as I knew exactly what it was. She came over and explained the whole deal to me and asked me to sign it. I did and that was pretty much that.

My dad had arrived a few minutes before the troopers left. Once they had gone I took out the ticket I had put in my pocket and read through it... "four hundred and ninety freakin dollars!?" I yelled. Freakin neglegent driving is what they got me for :(

I'm definitely going to contest the ticket as they have no proof of what speed I was going, they didn't write down what I said on the ticket, and since there was no damage to the car when I hit the ditch, it proves that I was going slow enough and that I more than likely wasn't speeding.

"Wow m0nk, you type a lot, is that all?" you ask. NO SIRREEEE!!!!

My dad backs his pickup up behind my car and hands me the cargo strap to strap it around my axle, so I get down there on my back (in my dress pants and shirt that I had been wearing all day :( ) And hook the strap around what I thought at the time was the axle. I gave my dad the all clear and he started to pull forward. The car moved about 6 inches at which point I heard a *SNAP*. My brain immediately went "YOU FREAKIN RETARD!!!" I had hooked the strap around the little brace that (what I believe) holds the rotor to the axle. The thing had snapped in two :( I did it again the right way and we pulled the car out of the ditch. I drove it home not exceeding 15 mph as it would start shaking like we were having an earthquake if I did so. Attached is a picture of what I broke.

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8O damn...sorry bout that. You can contest it all you want, unless you get a lenient judge having a good day. you're screwed. 490 bucks? please. that's rediculous. I see cops fly through intersections in rush hour traffic doing 70 mph in the middle of town...
 

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Holy Shiz dude. I feel for you man. talk about pouring salt into a wound that someone else already poured vinegar into. Let me give you and every one a few pointers about cops and speeding tickets... NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER.......... Admit to driving ANY speed limit at any time. Especially if they weren't there to see it and especially if it was faster than reasonabley prudent. For all they know you were parked on the side of the road and the wind blew your car into a ditch. The fact that they didn't put your speed on the ticket is a big plus in your case though. had they put 45 and wrote as stated by driver then you would have a hard time getting out of it. But in that case you could bring up the question "Had I said I was going 5 mph would that have made any difference?" If it is brought up in court that you confessed to 45 then you could also state that you were never informed that anything you said could be used against you. Anyway, next time anyone ever gets pulled over remember you were going the speed limit even if you guage read 110. I got out of a ticket this way before. I posted about it on here too. I was stopped for "suposedly" going 94 in a 50. Truth is my guage goes to 85 and the needle was well past that so who know what I was doing. When I was asked If I knoew what the speed limit was I said I thought if was 55. The cop said it was 50 and asked how fast I was going and I said I was going 55 cuz thats what I thought the speed limit was. The cop then told me he had me on radr going 94. I said I didn't believe him because I I doubted my car could even go that fast. I was like come on, it's an 89 Escort, there is no way it could go that fast. Anyway I got out of it mainly because I didn't admit guilt. I learned this from another incedent in My Mustang when a cop asked me why I thought he pulled me over and I blerted out "Public display of horsepower?!?!" I got slapped with a ticket for Drag racing on a public road. Up to $700 and automatic suspended license. Lucly I did my homework and I was prepared when I went to court. I nded up getting of pretty easy.
 

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I got a ticket and the cop actually put down that I admitted to leaving the scene of the accident even though I never admitted to it and it wasn't true. What he wrote down on the accident report was a lie plain and simple. He also wrote that I said I had been going 65 in a 25 (which was true, but I didn't say that I had been and he showed up an hour after the accident happened so how would he know?) Those cops will screw you, every time. Next time I get pulled over I am not going to tell them crap. I was polite and cooperative even though he showed up at my house at like 12:00 at night (after I had given the other party my insurance, address, and phone number, they said they weren't going to call the cops then they did anyways.) At any rate it was a freaking mailbox! Yeah. Don't let those bastards get you they'll take you to the cleaners every time. If I thought I could do it and get away with it I'd carry a colt under the seat as my 'cop deterrent' mmm.... J/K Really! Wouldn't do that. Anyways. It sounds to me like you are probably screwed really bad unless you get a lenient judge on a good day. I hired a lawyer for like 300-400 and got out of it with just 20 hours of community service and a DDC (defensive driving course). Vs. a $1000 dollar fine and jail time. For hitting a mail box for cryin' out loud! And I got it taken off my record too. Sucked arse though. Whenever I see a cop now, if they're not in a position to come after me, I always yell 'I smell bacon!' at the top of my lungs. It's my version of revenge. ;p Anyways. Hope you get off easy. That's complete BS that they gave you a ticket for sliding your car off the road and they weren't even there at the time.
 

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Here is your Defense dude http://www.leg.wa.gov/RCW/index.cfm?fuseaction=section&section=46.61.525

Negligent driving -- Second degree.
(1)(a) A person is guilty of negligent driving in the second degree if, under circumstances not constituting negligent driving in the first degree, he or she operates a motor vehicle in a manner that is both negligent and endangers or is likely to endanger any person or property.
(b) It is an affirmative defense to negligent driving in the second degree that must be proved by the defendant by a preponderance of the evidence, that the driver was operating the motor vehicle on private property with the consent of the owner in a manner consistent with the owner's consent.

(c) Negligent driving in the second degree is a traffic infraction and is subject to a penalty of two hundred fifty dollars.

(2) For the purposes of this section, "negligent" means the failure to exercise ordinary care, and is the doing of some act that a reasonably careful person would not do under the same or similar circumstances or the failure to do something that a reasonably careful person would do under the same or similar circumstances.

(3) Any act prohibited by this section that also constitutes a crime under any other law of this state may be the basis of prosecution under such other law notwithstanding that it may also be the basis for prosecution under this section.

The most they can fine you is $250 according to this unless they gave you Negligent driving -- First degree http://www.leg.wa.gov/RCW/index.cfm?fuseaction=section&section=46.61.5249 But they could only do that if you were drunk or on drugs.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
omg! pimp! i heart you dude! thanks a bunch. I never even though to check the RCW's.
 

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All in a days work.... We call them ARS's in AZ. I use them quite often whenever I have a question about a law out here. Like a lot of people say it is illeagal to put Neon under you car out here, but I think I found a loop hole that will allow it as long as the neon in the back is red and the sides are yellow. I don't know who would want to do that but the only thing I saw about extra lighting in the ARS's is it has to be red in the back and yellow on the sides. Never specified no neon. I also found out that out here if you are pulled over for doing anything under 10 mph over the speed limit all they can do is fine you $5 or $10 for (get this) "Wasting a finite resource" The way I see it is you payed for that finite resource with your own money, not to mention the taxes on it, so how are they going to legaly fine you for wasting it. You bought it you should be able to use it how you want. Geeez, anyway, glad I could help bro. By the way man, keep me posted on how this turns out. I am always for sticking it to the legal system and making it work in the common mans favor.
 

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Good read, man. Sucks about what happened. I can't believe they threw that shit at you. It helps to say as little as possible, and as clearly as you can. It's in human nature to not "censor" stupid things when you talk when you're scared. Like that "You know how to drive a stick?" line. Lol that was kinda funny though :)
I wouldn't be suprised if that was one big reason why they slapped you with that ticket. Law enforcement is corrupt. They don't give tickets on what happened alone, but also what type of person you are. You obviously gave them the impression of an annoying teenager, a kid who watches fast and furious and tries to pull the same shit they do, and is just generally careless.
I'm sure they've had problems with kids like that cause there are certainly a few in my town... especially this jackass with an integra, but that's another story.
Here's my story though, if anybody wants to kill 2 minutes. :)


Well I have only been pulled over once before, and that was for runnng a yellow light at about 50mph in a 30mph zone. He flashes his cherries, I put on my directional, do a nice easy pull to the curb... perfect distance away, in a nice quiet area. Basically trying my best to be the picture-perfect driver. Turn off my music, hands at 10-2, liscense out and ready. He waits in his car, probably pulling up my plate number information and stuff... meanwhile I'm furiously going through my responses... trying to come up with answers to questions he hasn't asked yet.

The cop pulls me over, here's the jist of the dialogue:

cop: "How are you, today?"
me: "Good sir, how are you?"
cop: (kindof taken aback by my assertiveness) "Good, thank you."
cop: "where are you headed?"
me: blah
cop: blah
me: blah
cop: "Do you know why I pulled you over?"
me: "No sir, I do not."
cop: "I pulled you over because you were accelerating through that stoplight." (I essentially ran a red and the cop was shrouded behind another car in the intersection- doh!)
cop: "Why were you running so quickly through there?"
me: (this is great) "I felt I did not have adequate time to come to a complete stop for the light, sir."
(reason why I got out of something I was obviously guilty of was because it was the perfect drivers-test answer).
cop: Looks at me speechless... his face looked kinda like "Damn, this kid is so guilty, but that's absolutely completely feasible."
cop: "Alright, just slow it down son." (hands me back my wallet and heads out to his car)

I shut my window and mumble under my breath, "I'm not your son... bitch" :)

Anyway, I got pretty lucky there. It helps to be clear about what you say... don't show that you're scared, be polite, always adressing them with sir or ma'am, etc.
 

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yeh cops are pricks...my first ticket was a 79 in a 65. i was following a van doing the same speed when i saw the trooper...i was pretty lcose to the van so i know he didnt clock me, he just saw that i was in pace w/ van so i was doing same speed limit...so he pull sout...i'm like ready to cry...he gets be hind me, flashes his lights and i pull over...

OMG he keeps goin...i was like phew, he had another emergency....Well about 5 miles down the road i see a van and flashing lights....Then i see the trooper in the middle of the highway pointing at me to pull over...

So i'm freaked out again, so i did...Well he writes me a ticket for 70 bucks...

what was wrong with this situation???

1) i was clocked at 79 in a 65...which is 14 miles over speed limit. On the bill, he circles the $70 bracket, which lists under it "driving speed offenses for 15miles over to 19 miles over" however, the $60 brackted covered "speeds at 11-14miles over. So i was over charged which on the ticket said 14 miles over...The trooper was gone, so i had to pay extra...

2)In rules of Ohio, no trooper working alone is to pull over more than one car for safety reasons unless there are 2 cars or more than one trooper in one car....

If i hadnt been so unfamiliar with the laws when i got that ticket, i would have easyily gotten out of it... that officer had no right to give me a ticket when he was in the process of giving that other van a ticket. and he had no right to over charge me for my ticket...

I dont mind in town cops, its those damn troopers that are only out there to see if we fuck up and tag us for it....


Also a little bit of advice my insurance company told me after one of my accidents...It is not illegal to lie at an accident by stating that you are not at fault. The reason for this is because you are not properly represented by someone familiar with the laws of traffic...
For instance, you move at a 4 way stop and get hit by the person to ur left....seeing as how u hit the person, you think its ur fault...supposing u didnt remember the rule of thumbs when it comes to 4 way stops...

you might have admitted fault and turns out gotten off because u were turning from the right...

SO NEVER EVER ADMIT FAULT at an accident....you cant get into trouble for being proven at fault even tho u blatently are at fault. And if u can get a valid witness compared to the other person who didnt have a witness....its easy to get off free.
 

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mOnk,

1) You can easily get the fine reduced to $250 (do you have a points system in WA? If so, you're still screwed there)

2) You WERE negligent and the only proof that they need is that your car was in a ditch.

It sucks that you got busted with no witnesses, but it's bad luck. Trust me, I've been driving for 15 years. I'v gotten away with a ton (including defeating a VASCAR by airplane charge for going 80+ in a 65 zone), but I've also gotten nailed for quite a few things too (accidents, speeding and a rollover).

My one experience that mirrors yours closest was my rollover. There was no cop around to see it, but the fact that my freshly lowered EXP was sitting a few hundred feet off the road in a field with the hood and roof caved in (it was back on its wheels) was enough evidence to give me a fine for what PA calls "too fast for conditions". Fight it? I wouldn't even think of it. Even though the "conditions" were sunny, 80 degrees, cloudless and mid-afternoon, I was OBVIOUSLY going too fast for them, or my car wouldn't have been in that field. (It was a fun trip to the ER in an ambulance, though).

Anyway, I know I am not being helpful, but I have been there, done that.

PS - replace those balding D60/A2s and maybe you can take the wet turns faster ;-)
 

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The trooper asks if he could try to get it out
another thought on that, he was prolly just asking so he could get into the car for a quickie illegal search (made legal by you giving him permission to get into your car)
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Wow bpletch, I never thought of that either. That makes perfect sense though. Luckily the only thing that might be remotely illegal are my under dash neons, which I'm thankful to say the switch can't be seen by the driver or passenger :) I definitely need to be more analytical if anything like this happens again.

And yeh, the next thing I'm going to get for my car are new tires. I haven't looked yet, or know what I'm looking for. Are there all weather tires that might give a little advantage in the rain? Or can anyone suggest some tires that are great all around? Thanks
 

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Wait, I know how you can DEFINATELY get out of this. Since you broke your lower control arm (I think) you can tell them that at the court. You can say it probably broke before the accident and was actually the cause of the accident. They never have to know that you broke it pulling the car out. You can say that whatever you told the coppers is irrelevant because you didn't know at the time that it was broke. You only found out when you pulled the car out. Since they can't prove whether it broke before the accident or because of the accident then they will never know if it caused the accident or not. With a lack of proof you should be able to get out of it or at least get it reduced significantly. If you don't think that'll work tell them you parked your car on the side of the road (to check a map or fix something) and it slid into the ditch because of the rain. In any case you should be able to get outa this one. FIGHT THE POWER!
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Hey! That's not a bad idea. The only thing is are they going to believe that I was just driving around and the thing broke on me? Should I have a mechanic look at it and have him write a statement? Or should I just take a bunch of pictures? I need the car by Wednesday to drive across state, so I can't keep it broken for long :(
 

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Don't make up lies about what happened; you already told the cop how fast you thought you were going. I think the most honorable thing to do would be to get the ticket reduced to $250. If you take it to court for that and they throw it out altogether, consider it a bonus.
 

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Is there any rust in that general vacinity? If so, just say it was rusted through. Rust can destroy just about anything on a car. If not, then that idea may not work. I don't think that particular part could break unless it was rusted through or you hit something, hmmm...maybe you hit a phantom animal :wink: . I don't know if taking pictures will help unless you can prove what date they were taken on, which is almost impossible to do. Take them anyway though just in case. I don't think a mechanic's statement would help either because he would more than likely say it couldn't break on its own. My idea was mearly a suggestion, it may or may not work for you. You can go about this anyway you choose, but you should probably fight it, as you stand a good chance of getting the ticket reduced or thrown out because no one but you actually saw what happened, that means you can say whatever the hell you want and they can't prove it true or false. The cop's report may be brought up in court along with everything you told him. However I'm not sure if it will hold up because you were unaware that your statement at the time could be used against you later. If it does come up though, you could tell them that whatever you said was probably wrong because you were still in shock from the accident. Sure its BS, but they won't know that, and it is a viable excuse most of the time. Hell you could even say a deer jumped out and front of you and you swerved to avoid it. There's no way they can fine you for a natural reflex.

I know someone is going to say "why are you people helping him, he screwed up so let him pay". My answer to that is this; I do not support the fact that he was going to fast for the road, but it is understandable as many of us have probably done the same, or similiar things. I don't feel, however; that he should be punished for what happened. No one was hurt and no property was damaged. The important thing is that he learned what he did wrong, and can avoid doing the same in the future. A fine is not going to change that at all. Besides, he is already paying for his mistake with the part that he broke trying to pull the thing out. There's my 2 cents.
 

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bpletch1 said:
The trooper asks if he could try to get it out
another thought on that, he was prolly just asking so he could get into the car for a quickie illegal search (made legal by you giving him permission to get into your car)
Yea I had the exact same thought. NEVER NEVER NEVER give a cop permission to get in your car, especially to drive it. You never know if a baggie might fall out of their shirt pocket. Also they have no right, they just abuse their position.
 

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My friend got pulled over while driving her mom's saturn. I know she doesn't do drugs or whatever; she never would. The cop 'found' a bag of marijauna in her car, supposedly. She ran over a curb and busted a tire, and was sitting there trying to change it when a cop pulled up and asked if he could 'help' her. He leaned over into the trunk, obstensibly to pull the spare out, and lo, he 'discovered' a bag of marijauna lying right out in the open. The odd thing is he didn't arrest her or anything, but tried to make her bribe him not to take her in for 'posession'. She didn't and he drove off.
 
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